[EN]Guess the city - languages problem

[Dschi-Rex]

Why don't you use a website translator like Google? You can browse a German site and read the content in English. For this board, this is the link: http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.sunflowers.de&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools

And don't try too hard if you want to post in a German thread. Just write in English - most users will understand you. The machine translation is often hard to understand... :wink:If you use the translators things like this will appear
"exactly such Äuserungen finds tala at you blöd…"
:silly:

Some (germans) have no problems speaking english. Feel free to post in english. Just my opinion :go:

[Kuno of Gersenau]

I would first like to say something to the "Guess the city"-problem and afterwards to the problem in general.

Probably the solution who was found in "GtC", eventhough it wasn't a result of commen agreement, was the best. I thought as well that there might be a way to integrate non-English speakers because I thought the potential was not big enough for two similar threads. But so far I was prooven wrong and I apologize to you Elvain, not having asked your opinion first as you are the thread-starter.

Now to the German/English problem general. I wasn't aware of that and did not know some people have such negative fealings about it. Maybe I can not really understand you because I do not have your problem...
I think this language-mix is something we can not completely control but maybe partly regulate. The flag system could work quite well. And so far there wasn't any problem in the Colosseum (where all unilingual threads are flagged) exept the one above. In the Inn I just see a problem that hardly anyone is using them...

I agree that many bilingual threads end up unilingual (?). But what's the solution? If you tranlate every word it gets a somehow annoying discussion and people who do not speak both would feel excluded again.
Splitting the OT apart might be a solution but I personally do not like it because it would be the last step to split the community in two halfs. But if this is what you want...
I know how some of you feel about "the good old times", I miss them as well but time is going on. If we separate the OT-section it won't be as it was some years ago, maybe it will get even worse than it is now. (I personally do not think it is bad now) Maybe some bilingual people might just stick to their first language (german in this case) and not bother to visite the other OT as I usually do not bother to visit the boards of the SF-games I do not play. And then the English speaking community is even smaller...
Maybe I'm wrong again, but I do not see any better system than the one we have at the moment.

[Derek]

This is an annoying discussion!
My skill in speaking english is probably not the best at all.
But I like the international parts of a forum. Why?
First of all, I can "meet" people from all over the world.
Secondly I can improve my skill. (I have a soft spot for languages)
Last but not least, I like especially the "City-threads" because they´re funny and interesting.

To split the community means, to discontinue english threads slowly...
I don´t want to put my foot in it, but unfortunately there are predominantly german users.

The discussion about the flags was already finished for weeks, so let´s end here.
English flag means: language English.
So don´t let us talk in circles...

[Dobber]

The discussion about the flags was already finished for weeks, so let´s end here.
English flag means: language English.
So don´t let us talk in circles...

Elvain was not available to participate in that discussion and it took place in a thread that he started and that he had flagged an English thread. He had just discovered the discussion and wanted to voice his opinion on it. From the response we are seeing, apparently the discussion was not already finished.

Hopefully this will help in getting people informed of the flag system and make it viable again.

[Derek]

Elvain was not available to participate in that discussion and it took place in a thread that he started and that he had flagged an English thread. He had just discovered the discussion and wanted to voice his opinion on it. From the response we are seeing, apparently the discussion was not already finished.

Hopefully this will help in getting people informed of the flag system and make it viable again.

Ups, sorry. My statement shouldn´t concern Elvain´s post.
I only thought it´s a pity, that this discussion (especially this thread) won´t end.

[Traveller]

Ok, could I ask what does everyone consider to be the problem! From what I see, most of you consider the problem to be in "separate thread aspect", i.e. that a unilingual thread becomes bilingual or a bilingual becomes exclusively unilingual. From my point of view, the problem is not "thread infiltrations", but that the whole board is turning to unilingual, i.e. German. It's rather logical, of course - more Germans are signing in the forum, creating more threads on their language, while the English members weren't so hyper-active recently and the increasing German pressure is pushing them (us) away even further. Which, of course, means that the ratio of German to English threads is going to increase even more, maybe till only (or mostly) German-speaking members are left and the OTBoard becomes a unilingual German board.
Now, I have one question though: If we should be free to speak all kinds of languages in one single multilingual board, then can I invite all the people from the Bulgarian KoH Clan here, so that we won't be confined to one single thread, but be free to make all the threads on Bulgarian we want? NaVatar and TKS could also start making Swedish threads, Frankish and Hawk Knight can talk in various Dutch threads, I could check the differences and similarities between Bulgarian and Czech if Elvain makes several Czech threads as well. Basically, this would indeed become a real Forum Babel and it would be inconvenient not only for the English speakers, but for everyone, wouldn't it? So, am I allowed to invite all Bulgarians, Swedes, Dutch and all kinds of non-English-non-German speakers to start making threads on our own languages in here?

[Elvain]

I'm sorry to speak in circles.

This discussion was started (as I said and Dobber repeated) because it took part in other thread where I wanted to voice my opinion, but didn't want to change a "game" to a discussion again. From reactions it seems it's not completely solved.

I wanted to discuss what the majority, especially those who can speak both German and English, think about the situation and about possible solutions.

There is less and less english threads in the OT forum, it is not only consequence of increasing number of Germans and German threads, but also it is a reason of "exodus" of those who can't speak German in this "formerly-predominantly international forum". In a circle of causes and consequences, non-German speakers simply leave the OT forum so those who stay have noone to talk to so they leave...

It is a fact. I asked what the German-and-English speakers (whose situation will change the most) think about possibility of splitting the forums. I thought it can increase number of English OT members again, but from the feedback I'm afraid it already is too late and even the English only off topic forum would die out very soon if the German-speakers wouldn't participate there.

From the outcome I have impression that with an exeption of Angryminer they mostly oppose it, so let is be as it is because I understand it would be uncomfortable for you to always decide if you want an international of German talk, eventhuogh the non-German speakers mostly support the split (if I understand it well). We are minority, we have to subordinate. Let's see how will it end, I hope I was wrong...

[FrankishHero]

And: one single post asking to stick to English (or translating the German comment) can ease the situation, and if necessary a moderator may help (forgive me that I do not visit the Gaming section too often, but I cannot read everything here).

Well, that's exactly what sparked off the discussion! I informed Excali that he had to speak English in an English marked thread, when suddenly Catt went completely berzerk and said I was trying to shove people out of the thread!?


Also, @ traveller:

According to my view, the problem is basically that new users don't understand the flag system. That's the only thing that needs changing, and thanks to Dobber's sticky, it has. I have good faith that from now on, thinks will take a turn for the better.

That does not mean that this discussion is ended, though, for Elvain seems to see a much stronger pattern. He's a bit more observative than me, I just watch Karima...

[Angryminer]

If there are any problems in the future regarding the flags then please throw a PM to the next moderator. I'm sure we can establish a more repectful and disciplined handling of flags if it doesn't work out any other way.

Angryminer

[RoadRunner]

...and maybe we should be rather strict on English threads, but less careful with German ones.

As I already said - I think it does no harm to a German thread if you post an English comment there. :wink: