View Full Version : Diplomacy seriously NEEDS improvment (and other things that need a fix in patch):
Damn Dirty Ape
10-10-2004, 12:30
agreed, it should be improved.. it's stupid to see the smallest of countries at war with entire europe..
Also, there should be time between declaring war and peace, and the other way around. Its so easy when some of my allies asks me to attack another nation, I just declare war, and a second later i offer peace wich is accepted...
How?
Via a game mechanic or the AI that asked you to go to war recognizing you went to war and becoming angry? Or what?
WHy not throw out how you plan to fix it and let all of us players know? We're your best resource now of how the game plays...
Damn Dirty Ape
10-10-2004, 19:34
just out from a day playing koh, but my hands and neck hurt,ghehe, so i had to quit..
why is it that say jerusalem declared war on me while i was scotland.. i mean.. jerusalem..they never even heard of highlanders let alone make war with me for no reason what so ever...
King Juhafin
10-10-2004, 19:45
i know this game is still very young, but how soon can we expect a patch?
you can expect it ... very soon
Why is there so much silence on the devs about this?
The details would be nice as there aren't really nay game bugs in the release (congrats- it's pretty clean!)... and the patches all amount to gameplay issues for me.
I don't buy that your publishers are forcing you into silence.
Is the feedback not valuable? I mean we're playing the game and suggesting changes that would enhance gamplay, so do the devs totally disagree?
1) we are not forced to keep silence ..
2) feedback we are getting here is absolutely valuable
3) not all things can be fixed and not all things we agree with but we will try to improve the game as much as we can
4) when the final feature list is compose for the patch we will anounce it
red_lion
11-10-2004, 10:49
I was thinking something along the same lines, but it might be easier for the devs to make the diplo action cost something that's already in the game - books or gold would come to mind. Besides, EU had it that you couldn't spam diplomats but had to wait a while before the next one could be dispatched.
I commented in my first impressions post that indeed the AI does too much diplomacy too fast. It doesn't know when to stop leading wars and focus on economy. Perhaps that could be something influenced by the ruler traits (which I feel is how it should be), but overall the AI is way too bellicose. Seeing kingdoms sprawl madly and then crumbling to two or three provinces happens all the time and fast at that.
My main quibble with diplo at the moment is that you cannot follow a long term strategy of who to be friends with, who to corner, who to subvert, because the balance of power is shifting so quickly that you can hardly keep up with it. Making diplomats courtiers sounds like a good idea, but since it takes one of the nine precious slots, it should be a powerful option, i.e. easily improving relationships, having an additional range of options, etc.
Hello,
it would be also possible to add "diplomacy" skill for marshalls - with that skill, when they reach a city - even unarmed - then the player would be able to make diplomatic decisions - the number of actions/proposals/demands would be influenced by level of this skill (1/2/3) of this marshall
OR
make special knight - like spy/merchant/marshall...diplomat
OR
add diplomatic ability to spy = spy and diplomat would be the same/just the player would give them differnet tasks
RL
Damn Dirty Ape
11-10-2004, 14:35
just got back from my scotland match again and just some pointers...
Would be nice if you could ask your allie to stop fighting with a country.. Im having relationships with 2 countries now from which im very wealthy..But the buggers keep fighting each other and keep demanding me to break off relations which is quite annoying, although nothin happens when you say no..
Why do people keep declaring war for no reason.. Just looking around the map, alot of people hate me for some reason although they've never seen me. I mean, why declare war, wtf i do, leave me alone already. God knows how many countries keep declaring war for no reason and so my happyness drops, which brings me to another point..
What's the connection with wars and cities.. Lets say one province has bin peacefull for over an hour and still people are unhappy because of war.. why? It doesn't affect them, i barely have casualties, i'm winning all the time, still they keep moaping about it. Doesn't make any sence
And like the other guy say'd, keep the ability to declare war to a certain realistic radius, i'm sick of puny one province countries who keep declaring war on me cause they're feeling like it..
Every one got a reason for declairing war. He wants your lands, you are ally to his enemy, you are from other religion, other make them attack you, other payed them attack you, they decided you are ugly. I don't see what stops anyone to declair war the rest. (other question is ARE they ready for war, we shall see in the patch).
Cities are not happy cuz your country is at war. Winning or losing is other matter. See the whole america was not happy because at the operations vs sadam, take in mind the distance. ANY war makes pople woried - thus unhappy no matter how and what, and I think there is not exception for this case.
To ask AI to stop the war might be interesting addon...keep in mind if they have not started the war they cannot stop it without cost.
Angryminer
11-10-2004, 17:07
Mind the distance. Vietnam.
Anyway, kingdoms with good relations don't have to be at war at any time. I only recieve declarations of war when either I'm at war with someone else and forgot to break my victims alliance to other nations or when I am excommunicated by the pope. In the first case I buy peace with money, in the second case I try to reestablish my relations with the papacy and can arrange peace again.
Of course - pissing everone off and declaring war randomly doesn't lead to good relations. It lead to the first World War...
:go:
Angryminer
Damn Dirty Ape
11-10-2004, 17:32
Vietnam..? Dude, these are medieval times...
They want your land and such, yeh they say they want that but between me and them are usually 5 other hostile countries and my marshals would squash them like bugs.. It doesn't make sence..
Conserning my Scotland match, i finally [ after long hours of screwing around in diplomacy ] accomplished to have peace with most of Europe...Finally i can concentrate on trade..
Bydaway, how did England, Wales and Ulster pop outta nowhere when my buddy Ireland ruled them..[ Rebels you say,don't bother, all out at once and all victorious, what a coincedence -_-* ]
Damn Dirty Ape
11-10-2004, 17:33
Mind the distance. Vietnam.
Anyway, kingdoms with good relations don't have to be at war at any time. I only recieve declarations of war when either I'm at war with someone else and forgot to break my victims alliance to other nations or when I am excommunicated by the pope. In the first case I buy peace with money, in the second case I try to reestablish my relations with the papacy and can arrange peace again.
Of course - pissing everone off and declaring war randomly doesn't lead to good relations. It lead to the first World War...
:go:
Angryminer
bydaway.. your knowledge of WW1 is pathetic...
yeah, remote kingdoms warring with the player and easy money should be fixed.
Well he doesn't posted nothing about the WW1. He mentioned a way to start a world war. Anyway that is not the point.
So you think your peasants and citizen are bloodlusted greedy for land dudes? Only marshals, king and rulers are. Even your most of the troops don't want war - noone wants to die. So medieval times is not excuse. Only in the movies soldiers are battle frenzied berserks. And if you got kindom power 4+ war times shouldn't be a rebel problem at all.
Sir Turylon
11-10-2004, 23:29
oh please... leave modern warfare out of KoH. I never recall hearing about Greece declaring war on India.... Why? because they never heard of anything past Persia...
Having the kingdom of Cyprus declare war on Wales because he is allied with England and Cyprus is at war with England because Cyprus is allied with Genoa who is losing ground to Aragon which is allied to Scotland who is a vassal of England.... doesn't make sense... (there, a bit of WW1 in KoH times)
War weariness can be explained in one sentence.
"When the men are away, the women cannot play." :rofl:
Seriously.. that has a lot to do with it. They miss their loved ones. Does it cause them to join behind a rebel leader and try to kill the king? no. Rebellions should be limited to extortionistic taxes and kingdom power level.
@last post.. a lot of cultures actually enjoyed conflict. I'll name two. Nordic and Irish. :go:
War weariness can be explained in one sentence.
"When the men are away, the women cannot play." :rofl:
*warning totally off-topic !*
man, what a great sentence :lol: Sir Turylon - i think i'll use it from time to time :cool:
Regards from your brother in arms ;)
Damn Dirty Ape
12-10-2004, 10:06
Well he doesn't posted nothing about the WW1. He mentioned a way to start a world war. Anyway that is not the point.
So you think your peasants and citizen are bloodlusted greedy for land dudes? Only marshals, king and rulers are. Even your most of the troops don't want war - noone wants to die. So medieval times is not excuse. Only in the movies soldiers are battle frenzied berserks. And if you got kindom power 4+ war times shouldn't be a rebel problem at all.
i didn't say the people were bloodlusty, point being, they kings of the smallest of countries find it amusing to declare war on you which is just onrealistic. Heck i've even had my allie declare war on me for a mere 3000 bucks, while i had 50.000 in stock, we were allies for hours but still he wanted war for a stupid 3000, come on already... It's just stupid how hard it is do have peace for a long time sometimes, simply cause any idiot can make war. Annoying also is still the fact that you cannot ask your allies to stop making wars, i've had many times someone would get pissed cause ireland refused to have peace longer then one minute
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